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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Is hostgator trying to get rid of me (Read 1,389 times)
freediver
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Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Dec 2nd, 2012 at 9:19pm
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I've been with hostgator for a few years now, on their cheapest "unlimited" plan (AU$10/month = US$10/month).

They have shut the site down or parts of the site 4 times in the past few months. The last time they shut the entire site down yesterday - no access at all. I noticed Sunday morning, which would have been good timing, except they did not grant me access again till late Sunday afternoon, and then the backup/zip function hung for a few hours. Anyway, I upgraded to the latest version of YaBB (from 2.5AE). They are still evaluating it, and have not yet officially re-opened the site to the public (that's 24 hours). Except they stuffed it up and everyone can access it anyway.

Each time it is a different script on a different part of the server - but pretty much the same story - either shut that part of the site down or upgrade the software.

One of the users suggested this might be their unsubtle way of encouraging me to upgrade to the latest version of the software.

Last time they also told me it was a hacking attack, so maybe that is becoming more prevalent. I have been running the site for about a decade and never had these issues. The biggest problem was the hosts going bankrupt all the time.

Or maybe the site is just too big for a cheap hosting account?
  

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Dandello
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #1 - Dec 2nd, 2012 at 11:43pm
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Sounds a bit like the hassles I used to get with PowWeb. Since YaBB is actually immune to the most prevalent forms of hacking (mySQL injections and bad PHP coding), I suspect your hosting service is not-so-subtly hinting for you to pay them more for 'super unlimited' service.  Tongue

Unlimited is basically a scam. If they can't or won't tell you what the real limits are, how do you know when you exceed them?

« Last Edit: Dec 2nd, 2012 at 11:45pm by Dandello »  

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Bill Myers
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #2 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 12:35am
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Dandello wrote on Dec 2nd, 2012 at 11:43pm:
Unlimited is basically a scam. If they can't or won't tell you what the real limits are, how do you know when you exceed them?

Certainly with other hosts I can attest to this. Hostgator wouldn't be any different. You can read their TOS here - just scroll down to "8.) Bandwidth Usage" for details despite the advertisements for unlimited bandwidth.

Basically, unlimited bandwidth means unmetered bandwidth, and all that means is that you can use all that you want as long as you don't exceed a certain percentage of your server's resources.

Even for those of us who have our own servers, you basically pay for what you get, so nothing is really unlimited.

  

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westwegoman
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #3 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 2:06am
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I don't know a whole lot about all the different hosts out there but if mine were doing that to me I can assure you that I would be looking elsewhere. I currently, and for the past 6 years or so have used 1and1 without problems. $7/month.

So far, my experience has been great.

Good luck.
« Last Edit: Dec 3rd, 2012 at 9:56pm by WestwegoMan »  
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Bill Myers
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #4 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 5:18pm
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For the majority of people, issues of bandwidth and server resources will never be a problem. But if you operate a site that becomes really popular, and your traffic is larger than most, then the kind of accounts that the majority of people use won't work for you.

When our company started up with an Internet presence back in 1996, I went through a lot of hosts because one of our sites that operated as a hub for many others exploded with traffic. Either the hosts couldn't handle the traffic, or the cost of bandwidth was so high that it wasn't a viable option for us.

Thankfully, unlike 1996, there are now many good hosts to use, so it's just a matter of deciding what host is best for you. If I wasn't so loyal with our current host, which quite frankly costs me more than I need to be paying, I would switch to another host.

U2K Web Hosting Services Provider is the host for this YaBB forum, and they seem to be reliable. I'd give them a try. Wink

  

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depablo
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #5 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 5:20pm
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Bill Myers wrote on Dec 3rd, 2012 at 12:35am:
You can read their TOS here - just scroll down to "8.) Bandwidth Usage" for details despite the advertisements for unlimited bandwidth.

7b.) inodes, another sore point I have heard discussed elsewhere regarding their hosting.
Good catch Bill.
  

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Bill Myers
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #6 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 6:11pm
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depablo wrote on Dec 3rd, 2012 at 5:20pm:
7b.) inodes, another sore point I have heard discussed elsewhere regarding their hosting

I hadn't thought about that for a long time (definitely needs to be considered no matter what host is used). I ended up disabling the catchall address option on our server because of all the activity. It was out of control!

  

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freediver
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #7 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 8:42pm
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I hit their inode limit a while back. I deleted some stuff I don't need and am back under it again. All that happens if I go over it is the auto backups don't work.

They have told me what the limits are for server use, but the only record I have is a text file via cPanel that only goes back 24 hours. I can't be bothered researching it. My real worry was people deliberately targeting my site due to the content. What they have said so far indicates that the problem is 'isolated' hacking attacks, but I think it might be more the case that that is the straw that broke the camel's back.

I'm glad no-one chewed my ear off about always getting the latest version. I also have a phpbb, a wiki and a gallery, but the settings on them are pretty tight (admin approval of new accounts etc).

I would happily pay double the price for hosting. I run google ads which more than covers my expenses. I just don't have time to deal with this nuts.
  

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freediver
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #8 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 8:46pm
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They just shut the forum down again, I got an email with a few tips followed by a suggestion I upgrade to dedicated hosting.

Quote:
Hello,

I attempted to remove the restriction and again found that the forum at http://ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl was using significant resources.

ozpolit 31310 22.0 0.1 31352 8216 ? RN 01:08 0:00 /usr/bin/perl -- YaBB.pl
ozpolit 31318 10.5 0.0 0 0 ? ZN 01:08 0:00 [php] <defunct>
ozpolit 31325 10.0 0.2 39864 16692 ? RN 01:08 0:00 /usr/bin/perl -- YaBB.pl

Recent Site Requests:
110.88.115.118 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=register
110.88.115.118 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=register
110.88.115.118 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=register
112.101.64.81 ozpolitic.com /poll/drupal/?q=comment/reply/276
112.101.64.81 ozpolitic.com /poll/drupal/?q=node/305
117.21.225.25 ozpolitic.com /poll/drupal/?q=node/9605
117.21.225.42 ozpolitic.com /poll/drupal/?q=comment/reply/1481
117.211.123.62 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=register2
122.141.243.215 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=register2
157.55.32.62 ozpolitic.com /cgi-bin/album.pl?photo=/forum-attachments//asylum_001.jpg
157.55.32.62 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?num=1351019879/20
157.55.32.88 ozpolitic.com /cgi-bin/album.pl?photo=/forum-attachments/Anal_torture2_00
174.139.58.236 ozpolitic.com /poll/drupal/?q=node/9690
199.119.205.9 ozpolitic.com /poll/member/join.php
199.119.205.9 ozpolitic.com /poll/register.php
199.119.205.9 ozpolitic.com /poll/register.php
199.119.205.9 ozpolitic.com /poll/signup
199.119.205.9 ozpolitic.com /poll/tiki-register.php
199.119.205.9 ozpolitic.com /signup/
199.119.205.9 ozpolitic.com /tools/quicklogin.one
199.15.234.134 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl
199.15.234.134 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=login2
199.83.88.242 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl
199.83.88.242 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=13545184;13545184=PdUxLlZ9ytAMvayyxh1
199.83.88.242 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=login2
199.83.88.242 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=print;num=1339842765
199.83.88.242 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?action=print;num=1339842765
203.21.40.253 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?num=1354435180
27.153.186.53 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?board=politicians/7580
27.153.186.53 ozpolitic.com /forum/index.php
27.159.219.104 ozpolitic.com /poll/drupal/?q=node/45292
66.249.73.16 ozpolitic.com /forum/YaBB.pl?num=1336295437/207


Since the issue is only with YaBB, I have adjusted the restriction only to apply to http://ozpolitic.com/forum/ so the rest of your site will at least function correctly while we work to resolve this issue. Unfortunately, we do not have specific recommendations for YaBB. In many cases, using page caching can reduce CPU usage, as it would pass the pages through directly instead of requiring that the script assembles the pages. However, here it appears more of the CPU usage is due to actions such as posting. Since YaBB does not use a database, there is little ability to optimize its data. I do see that this forum is being crawled by Google and Bing a fair amount, so you may consider signing up for their webmaster tools and lowering their crawl rate, if you have not done so already. You can find more information at the following URLs:

http://support.hostgator.com/articles/specialized-help/telling-google-how-often-...
http://support.hostgator.com/articles/specialized-help/telling-bing-how-often-to...

There does not appear to be any sign of attack here, just what seems to be legitimate traffic. I ran the site through a performance profiler, which has some additional suggestions:

http://gtmetrix.com/reports/ozpolitic.com/JGY5MFlf

There are a lot of 404 errors for images, so you may want to check your configuration and see why these images are not available. There are also a lot of resources that can be cached by the browser, but are not specifying expiration, so are not able to be. This can be corrected by adding something like the following to your .htaccess file:

<filesmatch "\.(flv|gif|ico|jpg|jpeg|png|swf)$">
header set Cache-Control "max-age=2592000"
</filesmatch>
<filesmatch "\.(css|js|pdf|txt)$">
header set Cache-Control "max-age=604800"
</filesmatch>
<filesmatch "\.(html|htm)$">
header set Cache-Control "max-age=43200"
</filesmatch>
<filesmatch "\.(cgi|fcgi|php|pl|scgi|spl)$">
header unset Cache-Control
<ifmodule mod_expires.c>
expiresactive off
</ifmodule>
</filesmatch>
<ifmodule mod_expires.c>
expiresdefault "access plus 1 year"
</ifmodule>


While these changes should improve performance, it is possible this forum will still cause performance problems. If that is the case, it may be that the site is no longer going to work well on shared hosting, and you may want to consider dedicated.

Once you have made the necessary adjustments, please let us know what changes you have made. At that point, we will reevaluate the account. If it no longer causes excessive resource usage on the server, we will remove all restrictions. Please let us know if you have any questions.


The poll bit is a bit of a worry as that part of the site hardly gets used, except by spammers.

Let me know if there is anything sensitive (technically) in that email that I should not have up.
« Last Edit: Dec 3rd, 2012 at 8:48pm by freediver »  

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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #9 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 9:15pm
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freediver wrote on Dec 3rd, 2012 at 8:46pm:
hey just shut the forum down again, I got an email with a few tips followed by a suggestion I upgrade to dedicated hosting.

Food for thought: Maybe you can copy/move your YaBB forum to UK2 so that you can at least have a working forum (or to another host).

I would also mirror your existing site there until you feel satisfied with how your site looks and operates, at which point you can shutter your HostGator account in favor of UK2.

Over the years I've mirrored our sites on other hosts when I considered a move, and these days the cost of hosting is far lower than it used to be, which makes testing other hosts pretty easy to do. If it works out, you move. It it doesn't, you stay a while longer until another host works out for you. Then it's just a matter of managing your IP address, and giving a bt of time for your site to propagate.

Even with the same host when our company needed to move to a new server in a different location, I operated our sites on two different servers until I was satisfied that the newest of the two servers would work out for us.

When it comes to our business operations, I'm obviously a bit paranoid about keeping our websites online without too much downtime, if any at all.

Admittedly, like so many other people, I hate change even when change is ultimately a good thing. In your case, it seems that it's time for you to make a change even though it'll be a hassle even if, and hopefully when things run smoothly.

I'm sorry you're going through this. I've been there a few times!  Angry
  

Morning, noon, or night, have a great one!

Note: This forum doesn't allow for us to freely edit our posts or topics to make corrections as needed, so please remember to look for subsequent posts if you see any mistakes or outdated information. Sorry for the inconvenience.
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freediver
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #10 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 9:37pm
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It looks like the price is going to go up by a factor of 10 at least.
  

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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #11 - Dec 3rd, 2012 at 10:26pm
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A factor of 10 is probably too much.

Bill and others have already mentioned UK2.net.  Our forum is there and they employ a former YaBB Developer, so you know its going to work.

I can name a few other good hosts I know (based on a paid consultation {running Yabb was a requirement} - about exactly a year ago).   

knownhost - I have two VPS's there now, neither is close to $100/month. They use a ticketing system for support, and are very very reliable.  I run YaBB on both servers. I think another serious 'yabber' is hosted there.

www.knownhost.com

hostcolor - they are in the Netherlands & Bulgaria (for support) their English is not a problem and they do (or did) telephone support.  They were almost tied in my analysis (I preferred the number and location of datacenters knownhost had at that time)

www.hostcolor.com

24-7host - next tier - very affordable. You would need to check and make sure that Perl is part of their CGI-BIN offering (it was as of last year)

www.24-7host.com

Future Hosting - A bit more money (still not 10x) Many datacenters, knowledgeable staff

www.futurehosting.com

You probably should also talk to WebMe. They have made an effort to provide support for YaBB forums, and offer (as I recall) a free 30 day trial.  They have a low price point - so you might what to let them look at your forum and tell you what they think. I can say they know YaBB pretty well.  Their price point is in your range.

http://www.webme.co.uk

In fact, many of these companies will give you a one month trial on request.  I have always found it a good idea to ask if they have other YaBB forums, and what version(s) of Perl they offer.

One thing for sure if you get a VPS, be sure its a managed VPS.  That means it is set up correctly at the outset, and you can get help.  Unmanaged VPS are only for the experienced Geek who can solve his/her own server issues (even then they can be torturous).

Good Luck~
Cool
  

I find your lack of faith disturbing.
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #12 - Dec 4th, 2012 at 1:54am
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Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I'm going to go with hostgator's Level 5 VPS, as recommended by their tech guys. US$105/month, including cPanel, which costs extra for some reason. It is cheaper than their cheapest dedicated server. It has slightly more CPU power, but all the other specs are lower than a dedicated server.

http://www.hostgator.com/vps-hosting/

http://www.hostgator.com/dedicated

I don't really have time to look into the other options. Maybe after Christmas.
  

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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #13 - Dec 4th, 2012 at 2:15am
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freediver wrote on Dec 4th, 2012 at 1:54am:
Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I'm going to go with hostgator's Level 5 VPS, as recommended by their tech guys. US$105/month, including cPanel, which costs extra for some reason.

That's higher than a lot of places, but it'll certainly be easier to stay where you are; at least for a while.

I pay more than I should be paying for our dedicated server, but I've been with the same company for many years, so I'm kind of loyal to them, and they've been very good to me.

Good luck!
  

Morning, noon, or night, have a great one!

Note: This forum doesn't allow for us to freely edit our posts or topics to make corrections as needed, so please remember to look for subsequent posts if you see any mistakes or outdated information. Sorry for the inconvenience.
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Re: Is hostgator trying to get rid of me
Reply #14 - Jan 5th, 2013 at 4:44am
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I have had a bit of a look around for hosts. Thanks again for the suggestions. I am having a bit of trouble comparing the CPU feature. I think that and RAM are likely to be the deciding factors. A lot of them say 2 or 4 CPUs, but don't give a CPU speed and don't say how much of that you can use.

This is what I have so far.

Current usage:
150 GB of bandwidth in December 2012
8 GB of disk space
300MB of RAM (fairly steady)
10 - 30% of CPU typical (2.7 GHz) - this has spiked to over 100%.

http://www.hostgator.com/vps-hosting/
level 5 VPS, US$95/month, plus $10 for cpanel
2.7 GHz, 1.8 GB, 80 GB, 1.4 TB (CPU, RAM, disk, bandwidth)

http://www.uk2.net/dedicated-servers/
UK$50/month
2.9 GHz, 4GB, 500GB, unmetered bandwidth (higher plans have 1TB)
add UK$12 for backup, 5 for server density monitoring, 10 for APC robots
60/month (total?) for fully managed

http://www.knownhost.com/
CPU speed?
US$45 for VPS3
2X CPUs, 1.5GB, 65 GB, 3.5TB (CPU, RAM, disk, bandwidth)
could probably go with VPS2 for US$35, 1GB of RAM, 2 CPUs

http://www.hostcolor.com/vps/vps-start
CPU speed?
2/4 CPUs, 0.8GB, 20GB, 1TB (CPU, RAM, disk, bandwidth)

http://www.futurehosting.com/web-hosting/virtual-servers/pricing
US$35, VM2, US$60 regular price
equal share, 0.9GB, 20GB, 1TB (CPU, RAM, disk, bandwidth)
  

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